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Traffic Ticket for passenger seat belt violation




web2000
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Member since: May 06




Posts: 849
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Quote:
Originally posted by Fido

Contest it - you got nothing to lose ... who knows what happens before the trial ?? If nothing else happens , you cannot get more penalty than the original ticket .....

Either the ticket may not come up for trial ( some times they have a back log ) OR the prosecutor may offer you a discount OR he may with draw the case OR worst case - you can still plead guilty and request the Judge to take a leneient view ... he may reduce the charge ...

I don't see no harm in contesting ....

What Web2000 says about Police Offiers not needing evidence is wrong ..In fact there needs to be undoubtable evidence to convict any one .... and a Police Officer's word is not enough if it is contested .



Police Officers have enough experience to make the statement undoubtable.


 
Post ID: 196941 22-05-12 13:28:37
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Fido
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Member since: Aug 06




Posts: 5286
Location: Canada


All statements are doubtful till they are supplemented with evidence ..... if the Officer's word was final , there would have been no need for a Trial :) ...

A Police Officer testifying does not have any more credibility than the defendant testifying .... You should attend some trials to understand this .

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Fido.

 
Last edited by: Fido on 22-05-12 14:14:45
Post ID: 196943 22-05-12 14:10:26
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web2000
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Member since: May 06




Posts: 849
Location:


Quote:
Originally posted by Fido

All statements are doubtful till they are supplemented with evidence ..... if the Officer's word was final , there would have been no need for a Trial :) ...

A Police Officer testifying does not have any more credibility than the defendant testifying .... You should attend some trials to understand this .



I have experience of attending the trials and I wrote based on my own experience.

Let us say that police officer gives a ticket for not making a dead stop at the stop sign. He can tell a long story in the court but other than his own statement/observation he has no other evidence. In such scenario police officer's statement is considered right. In this case, can you tell me what evidence the police officer can provide other than his own observation?
Police officer's statement is much higher weightage than the defendant. It is not the same.
I have seen it happening in the court.




 
Post ID: 196945 22-05-12 14:34:58
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Fido
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Member since: Aug 06




Posts: 5286
Location: Canada


That is NEVER the case ..... If the Officer's word was a finale , there would have been no option of disputing the charge .....


If you say , you did stop at the sign and he says you did not .... chances are - in absence of any evidence or photos or witnesses , you are free ...to be convicted you need to be proven guility without a doubt ...an Officer's testimony is no more important than a defendants ......... that s the reason why the Prosecutor drops the charges most of the times .....

As told to me by the Prosecutor her self :

' The Officer was here this morning but since we do not have evidence , the Crown is withdrawing the charge ' ..... Heard on another occassion in case of a speeding ticket ..

Defendant to JoP : Just because the Police Officer says this and I say that , would you give more weight to his opinion because I ain't an Officer ...........

JoP : No ... but I am looking at the evidence ............




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Fido.

 
Last edited by: Fido on 22-05-12 15:53:19
Post ID: 196949 22-05-12 15:31:04
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san-hugo
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Member since: Aug 10




Posts: 2009
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In Ontario every person inside the moving car must wear a seat belt else liable to ticket.

In the fine amount , $5 CADs is included for the court proceedings, so the invitation is already given to you by court and advance fee is taken, you may avail the facility given perforce and go to court else bear at least 2 demerits for next 2 years and fall into the hands of insurance robbers which they are already rubbing vigorously.

With a ticket cometh one time fine payment, lot of hassle, heart burns, taunts and haunts by wifey & MIL, court experience plus the recurring fine of increased insurance.

Bola ththaa belt laganey ko !!


 
Last edited by: san-hugo on 22-05-12 22:09:23
Post ID: 196959 22-05-12 22:08:45
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web2000
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Member since: May 06




Posts: 849
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Quote:
Originally posted by Fido

If you say , you did stop at the sign and he says you did not .... chances are - in absence of any evidence or photos or witnesses , you are free ...to be convicted you need to be proven guility without a doubt ...an Officer's testimony is no more important than a defendants ......... that s the reason why the Prosecutor drops the charges most of the times .....




I don't know if you have any experience of this but I have personally seen many cases in the court where the officer's statement (Officer has to say that he saw this or that and it is enough. Officers do not carry any video capturing device or something else) satisfied the judge to make the decision in favor of the Prosecutor. If Prosecutor drops the charge due to some reason then that may be his choice.
If officer has to provide evidence other than his statement then all cases (Except red light camera or speeding recorded on radar) will go in favor of defendants.


 
Post ID: 196972 23-05-12 09:40:45
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BlueLobsterMember of Administrators
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Member since: Oct 02




Posts: 3409
Location: Mississauga


Quote:
Originally posted by web2000

I don't know if you have any experience of this but I have personally seen many cases in the court where the officer's statement (Officer has to say that he saw this or that and it is enough. Officers do not carry any video capturing device or something else) satisfied the judge to make the decision in favor of the Prosecutor. If Prosecutor drops the charge due to some reason then that may be his choice.
If officer has to provide evidence other than his statement then all cases (Except red light camera or speeding recorded on radar) will go in favor of defendants.



Correct. Police officer does not have to provide video evidence for stop sign violation, his statement is enough. See here for full info...

http://www.ticketcombat.com/stopsign/stopsign.php

SS
You'll find some useful ticket fighting tips at the above link. Good luck!


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Are you there?

 
Post ID: 196975 23-05-12 09:54:41
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Fido
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Member since: Aug 06




Posts: 5286
Location: Canada


That is half the knowledge ... There are wrinkles to it ......Read further ... http://www.ticketcombat.com/stopsign/thescene.php and you will know how Officer's Testimony can be overtuned ..... People have done it ....

What I have quoted above is based on my experience ... You can challenge an Officer's testimony in court if you have reasonable grounds .... like .. what I mentioned earlier whether the vehicle was moving or stopped (in case of the seat belt ) OR whether the Officer was in a favorable position to make a sound judgment (in case of a stop sign )

2 mos. back a Physics Professor beat a traffic ticket proving the Officer's observation incorrect ...

http://physicsbuzz.physicscentral.com/2012/04/physicist-uses-math-to-beat-traffic.html

Like I said , if the Officer's words were final , there would be no need of trial ...

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Fido.

 
Post ID: 196979 23-05-12 10:31:04
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hchheda
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Member since: Aug 05




Posts: 2243
Location: Woodbridge


Quote:
Originally posted by web2000

Quote:
Originally posted by Fido

If you say , you did stop at the sign and he says you did not .... chances are - in absence of any evidence or photos or witnesses , you are free ...to be convicted you need to be proven guility without a doubt ...an Officer's testimony is no more important than a defendants ......... that s the reason why the Prosecutor drops the charges most of the times .....




I don't know if you have any experience of this but I have personally seen many cases in the court where the officer's statement (Officer has to say that he saw this or that and it is enough. Officers do not carry any video capturing device or something else) satisfied the judge to make the decision in favor of the Prosecutor. If Prosecutor drops the charge due to some reason then that may be his choice.
If officer has to provide evidence other than his statement then all cases (Except red light camera or speeding recorded on radar) will go in favor of defendants.



The only reason many people get convicted is : they panic in the court in front of all those people. However, if you stay calm and just claim that you do not see any proof supporting the charge by prosecution except the officer's statement, which cannot be admitted as evidence since he is as much a party to this charge as defendant.

The JP (Justice of Peace) has to either rule in your favour and if he/she does not, then his ruling can be easily appealed.

Most people get nervous looking at the prosecutor's gang and plead guilty with reduced fine. This scares others who are waiting for their turn.

SS : There is no harm in fighting, there are many avenues you can beat it.
Good luck.

Hiren


 
Post ID: 196981 23-05-12 10:51:45
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web2000
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Member since: May 06




Posts: 849
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Quote:
Originally posted by Fido

That is half the knowledge ... There are wrinkles to it ......Read further ... http://www.ticketcombat.com/stopsign/thescene.php and you will know how Officer's Testimony can be overtuned ..... People have done it ....

What I have quoted above is based on my experience ... You can challenge an Officer's testimony in court if you have reasonable grounds .... like .. what I mentioned earlier whether the vehicle was moving or stopped (in case of the seat belt ) OR whether the Officer was in a favorable position to make a sound judgment (in case of a stop sign )

2 mos. back a Physics Professor beat a traffic ticket proving the Officer's observation incorrect ...

http://physicsbuzz.physicscentral.com/2012/04/physicist-uses-math-to-beat-traffic.html

Like I said , if the Officer's words were final , there would be no need of trial ...




There is a need of trial because if police officer does not show up you win the case. As I said police officers have enough experience to make a good story in the court. Do you think they are not aware of the sites like http://www.ticketcombat.com/
Not everybody is Physicist


 
Post ID: 196983 23-05-12 10:54:52
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Contributors:
ashedfc(3)  bhootnath(4)  BlueLobster(1)  Desi # 1(1)  febpreet(3)  Fido(9)  hchheda(3)  
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