Brazilian shot dead on the London subway
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Quote:
Orginally posted by DiogenestheCynic
No you don't. Shooting people dead without sufficient provocation is NOT how police is expected to work!
Would shooting him dead after he blew himself up along with others...be the 'sufficient provocation' you are looking for?
Quote:
The guy obviously panicked, and given the situation, that is a convincing possibility. Even if they had to shoot, they could have done it to disable the man, by shooting in the leg for example. The man did not wield any weapon, and was not an immediate threat to anyone at the time!
Killing people because someone has a bulging midriff/wearing clothes not appropritae for a season is most stupid and cowardly to say the least.
read my post above to understand why the officers had to do what they had to do. What would you do if you were in their position and were supposed to protect the public.
Like I said...it think those officers willingly put their lives on the line and reacted on their instincts.
Unfortunately for all involved their instincts were wrong. What would you do if you were in their position?
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Quote:
Orginally posted by jake3d
Could...but they are not going to get away scott free. They are still accountable for their actions.
Apparently not. Giving officers a blanket authorization to kill whoever they want certainly doesn’t suggest accountability. Ian Blair and Ken Livingston, amongst others, have already gone on record justifying the officers’ actions. Ian Blair has also suggested in comments earlier today that more of such killings are likely.
Quote:
Orginally posted by jake3d
The fact was that it was four 'Asian featured' guys(for the most part) who did the earlier bombings and took part in the failed ones.
Does that mean that every person who has ‘Asian features’ should consider himself a suspect? Besides, what’s to suggest that they wouldn’t have killed him, if he hadn’t run from them (if he did indeed run)? They could have always reasoned that he moved his arm, or twitched his index finger and that was reason enough to take him out.
There are more unanswered questions. If the officers thought that the man had a bomb, why did they allow him to get onto a bus?
Quote:
Orginally posted by jake3d
And these tactics about subduing and shoting in the head...its borrowed from the manuals of anti-terrorist orgs from around the world.
Anti-terrorist officers around the world would have intercepted the guy before he got into a public area, if they suspected he had a bomb. That's where the competence of the officers comes into question.
In response to ON’s comements - this isn’t about being Hindu or Muslim or any other religion. This is more about an individual whom London police officers perceived to be ‘Asian looking’ and therefore apparently, it was justified to kill him! Today they perceived that a Brazilian was ‘Asian looking’, tomorrow it could be a ‘Hindu Indian’!
Quote:
Orginally posted by crenshaw
Apparently not. Giving officers a blanket authorization to kill whoever they want certainly doesn’t suggest accountability. Ian Blair and Ken Livingston, amongst others, have already gone on record justifying the officers’ actions. Ian Blair has also suggested in comments earlier today that more of such killings are likely.
I'm not sure of a "blanket authorization to kill whoever they want''. The cops have had to hand in their weapons and are under investigation...given desk jobs pending the same. Tony Blair has apologised for the killing. So there is no state ''blanket authorization'' like you make it sound. In these cases if they shoot...it better be to kill.
I do agree that they HAVE to exercise restraint before they shoot. However, they rapidly run out of options when the suspect starts running after the officers identify themselves.
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Besides, what’s to suggest that they wouldn’t have killed him, if he hadn’t run from them (if he did indeed run)?
Probably the fact that a sniper did not take him out when he stepped out of his apartment complex?
He did run...according to witnesses he jumped over the ticket barricades.
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They could have always reasoned that he moved his arm, or twitched his index finger and that was reason enough to take him out.
No, but it sure would be a good time to do it once they shouted 'STOP POLICE' and the suspect started running.
What do you think is the best time to do something like this?
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There are more unanswered questions. If the officers thought that the man had a bomb, why did they allow him to get onto a bus?
The cops are losers either ways...if they exercised restraint on the bus...you ask why. My answer is.. because they were not sure. If they were they would have probably arrested him before he hit the road to the bus wouldnt they?
They probably had not seen his electricians tools/wires whatever until then. Maybe they were trying to make sure. All maybes I'm not those cops so i'm not sure.
Quote:
Anti-terrorist officers around the world would have intercepted the guy before he got into a public area, if they suspected he had a bomb. That's where the competence of the officers comes into question.
I've already answered this above.
In light of the preceeding events, considering that places like subways are on high alert, I'd question their competence if they did not shoot him after he ran into the tube when they asked him to stop.
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In response to ON’s comements - this isn’t about being Hindu or Muslim or any other religion.
I agree
Quote:
This is more about an individual whom London police officers perceived to be ‘Asian looking’ and therefore apparently, it was justified to kill him! Today they perceived that a Brazilian was ‘Asian looking’, tomorrow it could be a ‘Hindu Indian’!
I hope the hindu guy does not run when he hears "STOP POLICE!!''.
. Or i'm afraid...i'll side with the Bobbies again.If some crazy Swedes start bombing the mumbai trains, I hope the mumbai police 'profile' Caucassian blondes(and not chinese pandas)
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Quote:
Orginally posted by DiogenestheCynic
Quote:
Orginally posted by jake3d
If I was in the place of those officers...I would have probably done the very same thing as they did.
No you don't. Shooting people dead without sufficient provocation is NOT how police is expected to work!
The guy obviously panicked, and given the situation, that is a convincing possibility. Even if they had to shoot, they could have done it to disable the man, by shooting in the leg for example. The man did not wield any weapon, and was not an immediate threat to anyone at the time!
Killing people because someone has a bulging midriff/wearing clothes not appropritae for a season is most stupid and cowardly to say the least.
No provocation by the poor soul. Guy just got panicked. Instead of disabling the guy, he was hit dead shot!!! Then police chief said - he was directly linked with the investigations. Later, he says - Oh No, Sorry abt that.... Well, I find this very irresponsible behaviour clearly doing racial profiling.
Heard this on the TV.
"We would shoot a suspected person in the area that is most likely to disable his brains, and hence any chance of him detonating a bomb".
Obviously if they shot him in the leg, he might still have pulled a string or something.
Quite pathetic. These are the Britons who till before the bombing had been so critical of the tough steps being taken in USA and now they have actually done something so stupid.
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Quote:
Orginally posted by Ottawa_Nerd
that when you are in a war zone, you should follow the rules of war...
What are the rules of WAR?
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I once made a mistake, but I was wrong about it.
Posts: 1754
Location: Ottawa (Now in Bangalore)
Posted on: 25-07-05 16:52:20
Location: Ottawa (Now in Bangalore)
Posted on: 25-07-05 16:52:20
Quote:
Orginally posted by mercury6
Quote:
Orginally posted by Ottawa_Nerd
that when you are in a war zone, you should follow the rules of war...
What are the rules of WAR?
When in a terrorist zone, make sure you always keep a low profile...Secondly, this guy actually ran away from the police when he was asked to raise his hands and stop...NEVER DO THAT.... of cos.."Friendly JIHADI's" from a particular community would not like to do that..so they will run...
Thirdly...this guy (acc. to BBC) was on an expired visa....So u see he was really shit outta luck !
I want Canada also to implement similar rules...Tough rules..very tough rules..and beat these Jihadis and their sympathizers at their own game !
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