Location: British Columbia
Posted on: 21-05-09 00:29:37
Do you have any related experience?
Do you have any evidence that if you were able to pass interviews/reference checks that you would be able to carry out the responsibilities of the IT position? The reason I ask is that if you have any related background, you can approach your job search as a mid-career changer and not have to feel you are being fradulent.
It is said that people change their careers 3-5 times over a lifetime in today's world. However, it is important to be savvy and explain your related experience and how it demonstrates your ability to learn quickly for example, and be an asset to a company and not a liability. ALso mention your plans to take XYZ computer course to update your formal training while you apply for training-on-the-job opportunities.
Do you have any computer training..mention that. Do you have any volunteer or hobby experience with computers..again mention that. Emphasize your related experience on your cover letter.
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~ Morning rain
No wonder employers here don't recognize even the genuine foreign credentials ......
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Vik
Quote:
Originally posted by pratickm
Both ORACLE and SQL Server are highly specialized areas (databases) and it will be very hard to talk your way through an interview without getting caught.
Yes, background checks, reference checks, credit checks, etc. can also uncover your lies, but usually all that comes much later (normally only when the company has decided to make an offer).
For someone without any knowledge (or only textbook knowledge) of these areas, the chances of getting caught in the first level technical interview itself are almost certain.
I concur. However, I am being trained by a practicing DBA for the next five months in Databases(development, not admin) and UNIX admn(both combined, two plus hrs a day). According him I should be good to go as far as handling the technical aspects of project goes. But when it comes to project management skills, I am at the mercy of my own resourcefulness.
My problem is at the initial verification stage.
Quote:
Originally posted by hchheda
I believe in IT and other high technology field with better paying jobs, the issue of references is now being moved online to sites like linkedin etc.. These are places where employers tend to check your references and credibility. The better your profile backed by reviews/recommendations by colleagues, juniors and seniors, the more authentic and reliable the candidate seems.
Hiren
Interesting. I'll look into it. Thanks.
Quote:
Originally posted by sville
Best entry point is to have strong fundamentals, positive attitude and build good references. Might take some time. But you can't just build Rome overnight.
Background checks is mainly for criminal checks. Credit check, well, is only for job positions where you need clean credit - mainly if you will be handling money or anything similar to that.
Besides Oracle and MS-SQL, other areas that might be worth considering are QA (Testing or quality) and Operations (production support). These are relatively new and has huge growth potential.
Good luck.
Thanks for the advise, I'll consider the QA(Testing/Quality) option if my finances permit me. One question though, won't I face the same problem(lack of relevant experience on my resume) when I apply for jobs in QA field?
Quote:
Originally posted by bjork
Going to India and getting the relevant experience for about an year may be a better option. But then again, there's a lot happening(for worse) in the Indian IT market.
I did consider that. However, as mentioned by you its not the best time to look for IT jobs in India. Choosing between two bad job markets ie. Canada and India, it is one of those rare instances when Canadian job market may actually easier to crack than Indian. Until the last year, Indian job market was kinder. Of course, all this is hearsay, as I have not tried Indian market yet.
Quote:
Originally posted by morning_rain
Do you have any related experience?
Do you have any evidence that if you were able to pass interviews/reference checks that you would be able to carry out the responsibilities of the IT position? The reason I ask is that if you have any related background, you can approach your job search as a mid-career changer and not have to feel you are being fradulent.
It is said that people change their careers 3-5 times over a lifetime in today's world. However, it is important to be savvy and explain your related experience and how it demonstrates your ability to learn quickly for example, and be an asset to a company and not a liability. Also mention your plans to take XYZ computer course to update your formal training while you apply for training-on-the-job opportunities.
Do you have any computer training..mention that. Do you have any volunteer or hobby experience with computers..again mention that. Emphasize your related experience on your cover letter.
morning_rain, could not agree with you more. I am not a complete IT novice. I have had training before when I was in India (in Databases).
@vikshr and @gktaurus, I was going through this thread:
http://www.canadiandesi.ca/read.php?TID=23393&page=1
How exactly are the potential job seekers in the above thread going to find employment without showing experience on their resumes?
It is more prevalent a practice than is generally acknowledged. I am not trying to rationalize it, just going with the flow.
Well, I will put 3 success stories down quickly.
1. I had a friend with Auto-sector background from Pune. He landed his first job in Canada with the government here, at an entry level. He had absolutely 'No' IT experience before. It was hard for him but his Oracle certification helped - but that was about 10 years back. He had to make lots of papads to get the job.
2. Another friend lost his job and after 8-9 months saw no hope. He got a copy of Oracle Financials and studied hard/practiced at home (also paid someone to teach him privately although he had no job). He faked his resume to show 2-3 years of experience and got an interview call. He was training for taxi driving (as a backup plan, since he was running out of time) but luckily took my advice the gave the interview. He got the contract and there was no looking back, since then. He was later making over 15K$ per month as Oracle Financials DBA.
Forgot to add that, although he didn't have IT Educational background but had IT experience for a couple of years as an Oracle Developer.
3. Another guy did the same as #2 (with Siebel) and landed a job with a major bank in Toronto.
Sometimes, splly when someone has a family to feed and a mortgage to pay - you have to work your way out. Nothing to be ashamed of as you are not putting your hand inside anyone's pocket. Not that I am also trying to justify this fake-ism here but sometimes it is probably unavoidable for greater interest.
And, at the end of the day, if you are not giving output then you will be ejected out, immediately. You go with your qualities.
One guy did a very smart job - this guy was not getting a job after landing here as he had no Canadian exp. So, in his resume he mentioned his experience as an USA one - it was a real web project (done in india) for some smalltime desi shop in the USA selling DVDs online. It got him a web developer job and he was really good at what he does - so why not ?
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If you are from non-IT background - then either join a school and take some courses or, do a quick course in QA (learn tools like loadrunner, winrunner, etc), read a lot about QA from the internet - and join as a QA Entry Level. It is easier to crack QA jobs than Oracle. Over here, everyone wants a finished product.
Later, keep on learning and trying to do some hands-on in other areas - we are Knowledge Workers - if you have knowledge - one day you will surely get there.
All the Very Best Wishes
Quote:
Originally posted by kunalcanadian
Without going into the ethics of it, how feasable is it to fudge one's resume in Canada?
I am planning to switch to IT field and according to folks who work in the industry, a minimum of three to four years will have to shown on the resume.
Most IT folks I have come across have done it at some point in their professional life in order to get their foot through the door(even Canadian born folks, though to a lesser degree).
My intended area of work is in Databases(Oracle, SQL-Server).
What issues should be considered in this minefield?
Background checks? Credit Checks(will it show where I have worked before?). References? HR checks(companies mentioned in the resume)?
I guess its now open season on CD!(runs for cover)
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Yeh Hindustan Hamara Hai
First of all, I need to appreciate JaiHo for that lengthy reply. Thanks man. Such real life stories are a great way to pick some useful tips.
Regarding faking, like someone else mentioned, depends on how much you fake. I met so many American colleagues of mine who fake too. When I say fake, it is more like enhancing. Let me give you an example. I know this guy who probably would have done some data loading in SAP SD module. He will put down his role in the project as SAP SD team lead or SAP Integration manager.
And whatever you put, you need to clear the interview anyways. So you can't have experience in QA, but put in your resume that you are a networking professional. Obviously you won't clear the interview.
And to all the naysayers in this thread, I will say just one thing. If we don't fake, someone else will. That's how the IT market is right now.
And recruiting in IT is a joke. I mean, have you guys seen the laundry list of skills given for any job requirement in US? They want system admins with MCSE and few other list of certifications, a graduate degree, expert knowledge in UNIX, linux, AIX, windows and a few other operating systems, networking, tcp/ip, all webservers in the world - websphere, weblogic, jboss and a few other stupid open source software which some IT manager selected. All this for 15$/hr position.
There are recruiters who told that I have 3 years of experience in Eclipse IDE, but they are looking for someone with some different XXX IDE experience. So they can't forward my resume to client. I recently started small talking to recruiters to see what the hell they studied. Guess what ...they have degrees in - political science, biology, English ...
Do you guys think desi companies like TCS, Infy, Wipro don't ask their employees to fake their resume? I am pretty sure there are many seniors in this forum who have work experience in these companies and they know what I am talking about.
Quote:
Originally posted by coolguyme
And to all the naysayers in this thread, I will say just one thing. If we don't fake, someone else will. That's how the IT market is right now.
....... Best excuse I have heard .... good excuse for robbing , mugging , conning ............. Have you ever tried to think vice versa ...... that there might be honest candidates who might lose because of your faking ? ... Well its all in the mindset but as the OP said ... not to talk about ethics ... I better Hsssssshhhhhhhh ... I am reminded of what a friend told me 2 years back - ' If you are confident you can do the job , fudge ' ...........
Clear a couple of certifications - OCP , MSDBA etc - that can add to your knowledge and lend credence to your resume .
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Fido.
Quote:
Originally posted by Fido
Quote:
Originally posted by coolguyme
And to all the naysayers in this thread, I will say just one thing. If we don't fake, someone else will. That's how the IT market is right now.
I am reminded of what a friend told me 2 years back - ' If you are confident you can do the job , fudge ' ...........
Clear a couple of certifications - OCP , MSDBA etc - that can add to your knowledge and lend credence to your resume .
I guess that is what I said in my lengthy reply. I even gave an example on how to 'pad' resume rather than fake some totally new stuff. I for one, was honest for 3 years in US and guess what - like I said, recruiters are stupid. They think if you worked on TextPad, you can't work on Notepad. Anyways, you are a senior member in this forum and I have respect for you. I accept that it is ethically wrong.
