A cover story in yesterday's Globe and Mail Newspaper asks “Do ethnic enclaves impede integration?”
Check out the reaction to the article and what bloggers are saying: http://www.garamchai.com/index.php?p=147
Location: British Columbia
Posted on: 09-02-07 11:26:31
I think that they can impede integration.
On the other hand they can also be a source of support , resources and a starting point for new immigrants.
I find it interesting when I meet those first generation parents who do not wish their children to become "Canadian". These are generally the same people that on return visits to India proudly display their children's 'canadian accents and canadian education.
Its not seeking the best of both worlds - its really making sure that your children belong in NEITHER.
If a canadian immigrant is proud of their upbringing in another country, and feel the affinity for their country, they should remember that for their 2nd generation children, Canada will be their first home. Being Canadian should be a thing of pride. Integration will help immigrants settle in better, and in turn, teach others about the world.
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~ Morning rain
Location: Canada-Glorious and Free
Posted on: 10-02-07 00:27:44
this sort of topic under discussion here.
Ghettoism is a real threat to new immigrants finding real fulfillment in Canada. Why? Simply because the tendency is to import the very issue that drove you out of the old country. All in the name of "maintaining culture".
There is really no need to be surrounded by people of your own background to maintain culture. It is like that blanket you used to sleep with when you were a baby. You do not need it now that you are all grown up.
Finally, maintaining culture is just an excuse. Culture is evolving constantly. The culture you are practising is not the culture your parents practiced.
BV
Location: carl sagan's universe
Posted on: 10-02-07 01:10:05
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20070208.CULTURE08/TPStory/?query=ethnic+enclaves+impede+integration
That's the link for the full article.
How many have been to a basketball game, rock/pop concert, clubs, bar hopping, play poker..?
Went to see Raptors last week playing the Wash Wizards. Good game. Also been to one on Vaisakhi day sponsored by Nav Bhatia- Hyundai dealer.
Booked for Nelly Furtado's concert coming up.
Saw Shakira last year.
Hosted a poker game two weeks ago for a friend splitting to the East.
Bar-hopping- waiting for summer. In the meantime there's always the bar at our pad- though we did go to Croc Rock for a farewell party for our friend who split to the East. It was before they remove the tables and make way for all the cougars- shucks!
Clubs- also waiting for spring/summer. Meantime just groove to the tunes at home.
Actually in India there are summer camps, pop concerts, bars, discos, cricket games (instead of basketball, baseball, ice hockey..)- just maybe the type they interviewed are not into these trips. I remember being a boy scout and going on all sorts of outings. Also attending cricket games, going to bars, discos, picnics, hiking in Lonavla, dating, and there was always Khandala(aah ha, purposely done and do I ever know what is going thru everybody's minds)
Yeah the ones they interviewed must be 'wierdos' -unless I was, am.
Or maybe they chose just to put in print those reactions that would 'aid and abet' the message they wanted to come across. Like you know, make a hypothesis, go out and do research and only highlight that which corroborates your hypothesis - that's how jounalism works at times.
Location: British Columbia
Posted on: 10-02-07 13:21:39
Quote:
Originally posted by investpro
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20070208.CULTURE08/TPStory/?query=ethnic+enclaves+impede+integration
That's the link for the full article.
How many have been to a basketball game, rock/pop concert, clubs, bar hopping, play poker..?
Went to see Raptors last week playing the Wash Wizards. Good game. Also been to one on Vaisakhi day sponsored by Nav Bhatia- Hyundai dealer.
Booked for Nelly Furtado's concert coming up.
Saw Shakira last year.
Hosted a poker game two weeks ago for a friend splitting to the East.
Bar-hopping- waiting for summer. In the meantime there's always the bar at our pad- though we did go to Croc Rock for a farewell party for our friend who split to the East. It was before they remove the tables and make way for all the cougars- shucks!
Clubs- also waiting for spring/summer. Meantime just groove to the tunes at home.
Actually in India there are summer camps, pop concerts, bars, discos, cricket games (instead of basketball, baseball, ice hockey..)- just maybe the type they interviewed are not into these trips. I remember being a boy scout and going on all sorts of outings. Also attending cricket games, going to bars, discos, picnics, hiking in Lonavla, dating, and there was always Khandala(aah ha, purposely done and do I ever know what is going thru everybody's minds)
I am going to play devils' advocate here. Who says that going to bars, rock concerts, games, drinking alcohol, smoking etc etc are being 'integrated'?
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~ Morning rain
Location: carl sagan's universe
Posted on: 11-02-07 11:49:44
Hi MR,
Maybe I read the article wrongly, but it would seem that there is an undercurrent there suggesting that summer camp, Maple Leafs games and Blue Jays games are part of getting integrated into Canadian society.
My point is though (read my last para) that coming from India the notion of summer camp, going to games (cricket in India, but here I also go to view other sports), hanging out at bars, clubs (which was in another article) and going to see concerts ( I saw Deep purple in Bangalore several years ago and also assisted many in Pune who did covers in Pune -my fave guitarist there being Derek Julian who still plays a mean guitar) is not alien to me and I do not see it as a part of integration into Can society but more of an extension of what I used to do in India. I also see English movies and play poker in addition to seeing Bollywood and playing teen patti
However there are many here from India to whom summer camp and going to games and concerts and playing teen patti is alien and they would not do it here. By the same coin there are plenty who are like me and just continue doing it here (money permitting) and add on poker to their flush activities and so on.
It seems the writer only picked to highlight those to whom the concept of summer camps, rock concerts etc. is alien. The others they interviewed to whom the concept is not alien were not written about.
Similarly, there is a girl who says she will go to India to marry because of her Indian-ness. However I know so many who marry other Indians from Canada and still think they have a lot of Indian- ness in them.
Anyway, I had started a thread re integration and I believe it was Jake3rd who commented that the concept of integration is being confused with the concept of assimilation in many cases.
If you don't mind me asking, do you read the same undercurrents in the article that I do that summer camps etc are a part on integration? I know so many born and bred of many generations Caucasian Canadians who have never been to summer camp, not gone to a rock concert, nor played poker, yet you can't get more Canadian than them.
What is your notion of integration?
I would rather a discussion than an argument( playing devil's advocate suggests inviting arguments to me but maybe that is not your intention- just a plain discussion)
Some information related but not really relevant to the discussion above is that we will always be confused about our true identity just like the african americans in USA.
Recently 50 Cent(Curtis Jackson - Rapper) called Oprah Winfrey a Oreo Cookie(black on the outside/white on the inside). Another Oriental was accused by their own people as a banana(yellow on outside and white inside).
I know many Desis in India who are Coconut's(brown outside/white inside).
The confusion exists, persists and will remain!.
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Speech by Thomas Friedman of The New York Times....
"When we were young kids growing up in America, we were told to eat our
vegetables at dinner and not leave them. Mothers said, 'think of the
starving children in India and finish the dinner.' And now I tell my
children: 'Finish your maths homework. Think of the children in India
who would make you starve, if you don't.'"
