Why Canada Needs Immigrants
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Posted on: 31-07-04 11:33:53
Quote:
Orginally posted by desi_student
So ,
India loses a professional (because he has been ill-informed)
Canada loses a professional (because it cannot provide a job in same profession)
The professional loses his self-esteem (because he is mopping the floor)
The only one laughing his way all the way to the bank is sanjeevm's old fogie !!!
Yes, if you only consider those Indians who're jobless or doing survival jobs, yet were doing good jobs in India.
What about people who're well-qualified from India and also happy here in Canada? There are thousands upon thousands of Indians who are doing quite well here and happy. That does not mean theyy're traitors who hate India, they have just found a new home for themselves in a life they are more content with.
Its no big secret that immigrants are the fuel for Canada's economy today, the last Census report stated that very clearly. And I don't see a big capitalist conspiracy if Canada is encouraging immigration because it needs immigration. The only other reason to allow immigration would be on humanitarian grounds and Canada has one of the most liberal refugee policies too (unlike a country like Australia where refugees on leaking boats are turned away and left to die)
Also, I disagree with the notion that poor ill-informed people are being roped in with big promises. This may have been true in the past, but with the advent of the internet and by virtue of the fact that there are so many desis here, MOST people know the reality from there before coming here. Do they care?? No sir. I was in India in January and I had at least 3 people with established careers come up to me. The conversation was as follows "Look, I know that life in Canada is tough, I've heard these stories from people. But I'm willing to do ANY kind of job, man. I just want to get out of the chaos here." You can try telling them that Canadian Immigraiton is a big conspiracy.
This is not to say that some changes are not warranted. If so many immigrants who come here based on their qualifications are facing such a tough market, the Canadian govt. should do more to educate them on the reality here.
But the whole notion that some poor ill-informed people are fooled into coming to this hell from their perfect lives from a foreign land and that there is some conspiracy propagated by the Canadian govt. in Conjunction with employers here is imaginative at best. People CHOOSE to migrate because in some ways or others, they are unsatisfied with the circumstances they're locked in. And they want to try for something different and better. That does not mean something different will always be something better.
Here are my questions
1) If not for its own needs (and not on humanitarian grounds) what other reasons should Canada encourage immigration for?
2) A lot of people in "desh" (whereever that may be) are now aware of the ground realities here. (thanks to CanadianDesi and other resources for this). Why do they still choose to come?
3) (Drumroll for the million dollar question..........)
If 90% of immigrants are so unhappy with their lives in Canada and Canadian govt. is so evil, why are they all still here? One reason may be they're unwilling to face their relatives back home, but if the issues are bread-and-butter, it would be pretty silly not to go back because of that reason.
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Quote:
Orginally posted by BlueLobster
2) A lot of people in \"desh\" (whatever that may be) are now aware of the ground realities here. (thanks to CanadianDesi and other resources for this). Why do they still choose to come here?
3) (Drumroll for the million dollar question..........)
If 90% of immigrants are so unhappy with their lives in Canada and Canadian govt. is so evil, why are they all still here? One reason may be they're unwilling to face their relatives back home, but if the issues are bread-and-butter, it would be pretty silly not to go back because of that reason.
Very well put BL. Infact, this is something that I have always asked disgrunted immigrants (though I consider myself as one of the so many failures) - and about a year or so back, I had written an article titled 'Is Canada the right place for you?'
This life offers various choices - and if we choose to keep living in Canada, it is purely our choice, no one forces us to. Whatever Canadian Govt does is what they think is best for them and they show the carrot to entice people to come into Canada. Similarly, the immigrants who land here and continue to live here, do so because they think it is best for them, not because of love for the Canadian Govt or obligations to the Canadian society.
Two years back my niece who works for a multinational in India, with husband well settled in his partnership business, wanted to migrate to Canada. I told them the ground realities and still they were wanting to come here since the life in Delhi was turning to hell with no time left for family and yourself if you want to be successful. They did their homework, came to Canada for a visit in May this year to know more about the country. Yesterday I talked to her for 45 minutes trying to convince her to apply for Canadian PR because I feel that they will not have problem in settling down here (imagine me telling someone that - me who tries to stop people from coming to Canada) - and I am happy that she has taken a decision NOT to apply for PR. Being an educated and well settled family, they decided that it is not worth starting all over again - though they are both below 40.
So, it is a choice they are making. And as I always say - it finally boils down to the choice you, me and we all are making for any reason!
In my view, a wise person would make one of the two choices:
1. Leave Canada for all the reasons he/she does not like it for and go back home, or
2. Stay here and fight it out to make it a success.
Those who stay in between, will never be happy (speaking from my own experience again). I have chosen no. 2 with a time frame of 5 years or will go back to alternative 1. But I have decided not to stay in between - and make life a living hell for me.
Chandresh
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Chandresh
Advice is free – lessons I charge for!!
Encouraged by Sanjeevm's real life incident, let me also narrate a real life story. This would highlight how differences in perception and vision make or mar ones life's dreams. The story does not have a direct relationship with the topic under discussion but one can certainly see the tangential relevance.
Everything in the story is true except the names.
Nearly 4 years ago two Indians-unknown to each other-arrived here in Toronto. Let us call them Ram and Shyam. Ram, Shyam and YoursTruly shared the same apartment. Somehow we found a common wavelength and, in general, had a good time for a while. Both Ram and Shyam were unmarried but had girlfriends in India to whom they intended to marry in the near future.
Ram was an expert in marketing and sales back home and a typical Yuppy. Had a great way with girls and all that goes with it. Shyam was a diploma-holder from Aptech with a couple of years of teaching experience in the same institute. He was a down-to-earth guy with a determined look.
We all three did try to get the jobs matching our skills but were not successful. I am skipping my details because of their irrelevance to the story.
Finally Ram did get a $9 an hour job in a call centre. His initial happiness soon turned to gloom when the harsh realities of the job dawned on him. He was not able to come to terms with the job situation because of his background. In a few months time he was 'laid-off'. This hiring-and-firing process continued. His bank balance continued to take hit after hit and as a result his frustration started to mount. His fiancé was in the field of teaching and Ram was aware of the acute teacher shortage in Canada. He decided to get married and sponsor his wife. That was done after he had completed 18 months in Canada.
When he came back he brought some more money from his parents. Unfortunately this time he could not get anything better than $6.75 an hour job at a store. This could be because he could not provide good references. With such low wages he was hard-pressed to pay the rent not to speak of wasting money on other pursuits. He also started borrowing from his friends. His sister in USA gave him a Visa card to make both ends meet. By the end of second year he was in such a sorry economic and mental state that he was not able to think rationally. He took the decision to go back. And before he did that he, like any frustrated immigrant, maxed his line-of-credit and all credit cards. We saw how two years transformed him from a confident and fun-loving guy to a nervous and dejected person. I have no clue how he is doing in India.
On the other hand Shyam came to Canada with a single-minded mission. He gave himself five years to amass $100,000 (Rs. 33 lakhs) and if by that time things do not turn for the better he’d go back and marry his sweet heart and live happily after.
He could not get a call centre job as his proficiency in English was not to the desired level. He instead landed a $12 an hour job in a factory inspecting the quality of plastic furniture with occasional light lifting work. His Indian education and qualification were worth nothing in this job market. But as I mentioned he was a determined guy and always focused on his objectives. His philosophy was if you want things you enjoy, then you have to do things you do not like.
In his second year of stay he started going to college part-time to complete one-year networking course. After completion he got a job in a call center as a technical support person. Now it is his fourth year and he is now pretty close to meeting his target. He is going to India to get married. He wants his wife to stay here for at least one-year. Then they would take a collective decision about future course of action.
For him both avenues are open.
The clear message for all the immigrants is stay focused but at the same time have an exit plan.
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Man's Best Friend 
Quote:
Orginally posted by chandresh
So, it is a choice they are making. And as I always say - it finally boils down to the choice you, me and we all are making for any reason!
Chandresh
Exactly! ANY big decision in life is about you making a choice.
The initial reaction for most of us to any adversity is to blame the circumstances. But its understood that after doing that, you start thinking about and focusing on what YOU can do about the situation, because circumstances left to themselves may walk all over you. After a duration of that laser-intensity focus, you should be able to decide the 0 or 1 of the situation. I don't believe in hanging onto that state of semi-suspension, the 0.5.
I'm guessing what happens in most cases about Canadian Immigration is those who haven't met with their desired life (in some cases despite being ok professionally) are always two-minds about whether to stay or go back. Honestly, I think going back is even a tougher decision than coming here. Cause there's no carpet of roses waiting for you there too, you know full well the ground realities back home. If there were, it would be a pretty easy decision.
And that's why they decide to stay back, albeit still discontent with life here. I wonder how long that can go on, I don't find that a very healthy situation to be in.
It is not necessary that everybody will be happy with their decision to migrate, it is quite unlikely statistically. It is also highly improbable that you walk into a country and you'll get exactly the life you want. At some point in time, you have to make a decision which evils are easier to live with, pick one country (with maybe a time-frame attached) and then not look back.
Personally I'd be very perturbed if I was always two-minds over this.
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Why I am not leaving Canada (or Actually I should Put it Why cant leave Canada).
To BL,
I have sponsored my Mother (widow) and Borther. Borther is goingto bein Final year of Bachelors course at UFT this year. At present I cant leave them here Just like that. They will not be able to support themselves short of going on Welfare. and we all know how pathetic life could be on Welfare.
SO I am here at leats till my brother completes his course in mid 2005.
I am also the Elder Indian Son, hence all responsibilites fall on me.
the above is Just a part of the Story. I dont want to go thru it in detail.
I came to USA in 1996 and wanted to be there, couldnt because of Family responsibilities. I left to come to Canada in 2000
SO I am neither here nor there.
Trust me, I am not here by choice.
I hate every moment of it here.
My situation is not unlike Ram (read YourTruly's post above).
in my mind I Just cannot compromise (like many have done) and do some course and work as a technician all my life here.
In USA i was getting close to 80K and working for a very prestigious company. the downslide was dramatic and it took me by surprise. I was absolutely not prepared for it.
SO you must understand that why a lot of people Just dont or cant leave.
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I once made a mistake, but I was wrong about it.
But Merc., aren't those very personal reasons that Canadian Immigration has nothing to do with? On the contrary, Canadian immigration is at least allowing you to sponsor your Mom and your bro, you know the U.S. does not even allow that.
Quote:
Trust me, I am not here by choice.
I hate every moment of it here.
Would you feel the same way if you had a good jobhere? (You can forget about the equivalent of 80k U.S., I did too
)And say once you're able to leave in 2005, where will you go, U.S. or India?
Quote:
in my mind I just cannot compromise (like many have done) and do some course and work as a technician all my life here.
That's actually great, I am the same way. Couple of years back, I was unemployed for 10 months at a stretch and was under immense pressure to take up some survival job, I did not relent however and call it fortune or persistence, I managed to get a job back in my field. I know some others who've been without jobs for over a year and still managed to get back into their fields of expertise.
You're in IT, right? There are a bunch of IT guys on the forum here, how about letting us help you out with that? I'm willing to do my bit so if you're interested, send me a PM.
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Hi desi student,
You are absolutely right !!!!
But young man...you are extremely fortunate that you are 19 and are in Canada as a student. By the time you get a Canadian degree...and have 3 to 4 years of local living or part time work exp (let it be pizza / Tim Hortons) thats all considered good enough experience for a good future job...
And you dont have regrets of doing high level jobs in India or elsewhere...leaving that and coming here....
A University degree from canada will stabilize your life..so be happy....
I had explained in my earliesr posts....SUCCESS in canada.....
1. Skilled workers - Carpenters, Welders, Mechnics, X ray Technicians, Trailer drivers, Crane operators etc coming from India......90% SUCCESS
2. Highly Highly skilled - Rocket Scientists, Ph. D Bio Tech Research, FRCS Doctors, Main Frme level prog. with IBM etc - 90% SUCCESS
3. Normal Graduate : People doing normal clerical jobs in India - if you are happy to work in call centres, small stores and shopping malls - 70% SUCCESS
4. Professional : Engineers, CA, Marketing Analyst....If you are holding good positions in India, getting good salaries having good standard of living and if you are 35+ then SUCCESS rate is 20%
Now its upto you to figure out where you belong......
Self employed and entreprenuers are exempted..
Deep
U win some..loose some..everything is not justified in this world......
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U win some...lose some...everything is not justified in this world.
