Are there any Indians or are we just a bunch of Gujjus, Bongs, Sikhs, Brahmins,
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Quote:
Orginally posted by tamilkuravan
Big B,
Can you tell us more about your self. Being associated with Neil Armstrong is a thing which even many millionaries are not able to do.
Were you with NASA at any point of time (i mean working there?).
To me , you sound like a person of great academic background and/or a millionare?
Any reason as to why you choose to stay in Canada. (Please be as discreet as possible. This is a public board and hence reveal only what you want to reveal or send me a PM. I have already PM'ed you).
and BTW, What Neil Armstrong had confided in you had already been published in an article.
TK
There are things I have been privileged and fortunate enough to do in my life so far that even milionaires (maybe) would not be able to...or even if they did..would not have appreciataed (maybe) as much - since they would have either paid for it and/or done it because it sounded cool - instead of being what they really wanted to do.
Yes...if I do indeed count my blessings - I am a millionaire...
I have had the privilege of meeting some really astounding human beings who have touched and impacted my life hugely. I live the best I can to do them and my parents proud.
So why am I here? Like Aristotle once said...because I have to be somewhere! I have lived in various parts of the world.. and loved every one of them...I have travelled to most countries and enjoyed something in each. My kids travel to India every year to spend time with their cousins and grand parentd and they love every minute of it - the noise, the activity, the pollution, the sounds, the chaos, the vibrancy, the colours ....I have chosen to live here for a while...since love nature, wide open spaces and my kids love the snow...simple but pure reasons....and no...I have never been part of NASA, but my son is keen to get there.
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Big B
Posts: 5775
Location: God's own country
Posted on: 11-02-06 17:45:30
Location: God's own country
Posted on: 11-02-06 17:45:30
Big B,
Thanks for the reply and Welcome to Canada!
TK
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I am a Gents and not a Ladies.
Quote:
Orginally posted by Big B
I did not try and make the issue or te definition very complex. I believe most things in life can be broken down into simple parts...so too this one. So here is my definition...which you are most free to disagree with....hopefully it does not make you sick like Chandresh!!!!....
They have never felt the need to establish or strengthen the relationship based on commonlaities related to language, caste, state, or religion. An equation was struck based on common interests....either a game or an author or a set of films or a leader et al....and then when we understood tat we have tons to talk about, discuss, debate, argue and have fun with...we became and stayed friends. What I am saying is..in my book a true Indian is one who does not see himslef first as a Bengali, or a Marwari or a Muslim or a Hindu or a Brahmin first...but as a person with values, viewpoints, a thinking brain, the openness to accept differing opinions and knows how to handle them...and does not have to resort to insignificant and petty similarities that were accidents of birth to gain acceptance or accept others.
Great points! There is however a fundamental conflict in the definition. Because the above approach is the end of nationalism and the beginning of humanism. I don't think it is possible for someone who genuinely employs the above thoughts to focus on "Am I a good Indian?". Even if it starts for someone as a definiton of being a good Indian, it is only a matter of time before the thinking brain will extrapolate this to be a definition of a good human being.
And then once that happens, this person will resent equally the idea of "Indians seeking out Indians" as you do "Indian communities seeking out Indian communities". I'm sure Neil A's one of those guys.
Anyways, its a good discussion to have. At least you got Jake to start posting again
. And please don't be offended if someone comes out strongly in their views against you, its all part and parcel of this being a discussion forum on this thing called internet. -----------------------------------------------------------------
Are you there?
Quote:
Orginally posted by BlueLobster
At least you got Jake to start posting again
. Actually I was trying to get my papers in order for my tax returns(since I dont think i'll have the time after feb). I enjoy doing that so much that I was just waiting for an excuse to get distracted and do something else. This thread was god sent-----------------------------------------------------------------
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Quote:Thanks for your comments. They are appreciated like I do all comments when put forward in a decent and civil manner. I have never felt offended by anything other than rudeness, disrespect and fanaticism.
Orginally posted by BlueLobster
Quote:
Orginally posted by Big B
I did not try and make the issue or te definition very complex. I believe most things in life can be broken down into simple parts...so too this one. So here is my definition...which you are most free to disagree with....hopefully it does not make you sick like Chandresh!!!!....
They have never felt the need to establish or strengthen the relationship based on commonlaities related to language, caste, state, or religion. An equation was struck based on common interests....either a game or an author or a set of films or a leader et al....and then when we understood tat we have tons to talk about, discuss, debate, argue and have fun with...we became and stayed friends. What I am saying is..in my book a true Indian is one who does not see himslef first as a Bengali, or a Marwari or a Muslim or a Hindu or a Brahmin first...but as a person with values, viewpoints, a thinking brain, the openness to accept differing opinions and knows how to handle them...and does not have to resort to insignificant and petty similarities that were accidents of birth to gain acceptance or accept others.
Great points! There is however a fundamental conflict in the definition. Because the above approach is the end of nationalism and the beginning of humanism. I don't think it is possible for someone who genuinely employs the above thoughts to focus on "Am I a good Indian?". Even if it starts for someone as a definiton of being a good Indian, it is only a matter of time before the thinking brain will extrapolate this to be a definition of a good human being.
And then once that happens, this person will resent equally the idea of "Indians seeking out Indians" as you do "Indian communities seeking out Indian communities". I'm sure Neil A's one of those guys.
Anyways, its a good discussion to have. At least you got Jake to start posting again
Now to clarify one oter point - I do not resent anyone seeking out another in a gesture of friendship - only feel sad that people restrict their universe so completely by narrow parochial definitions and assumptions about whom they will get along with. First seek our decent humans and if they also happen to be of the same caste, sub caste, state, relsiogion and natinality -- yippie its a big bonus day!
Finally - I see no conflict between nationalism and humanism - they do not have to be mutually exclusive., Insecurity makes people feel that way. I can be very proud of my nationality and yet be good to others and respect their nationalities too. Why does my nationalism have to take the form of imposing my superiority over others.
Take a deep breath all- all listen to Lennon's Imagine once again...dim the lights...relax and absorb the melody and the lyrics...be in the moment...and dream for 5 minutes. If we do not dream..then how do we make them come true?!!!!
Take care all...and that's including you Chandresh!!!
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Big B
Quote:
Orginally posted by naudurivsm
I agree, but children do catch these things well when they are young. And when they are young as a parent you should teach them some good values and culture.
So some kind of preaching is required for kids, And with this, as they grow, they tend to incline more towaards these values.
Nothing comes automatically, and particularly this subject, it is not that easy. you know that right?
I do expose my kids to my ideas and value system but I sincerely hope that my kids question every value I preach. My value system is good enough for me(and is flexible) but may not be good enough for them. I am living my life at my own terms and having a blast. I want my kids to have the freedom to do that too.
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Quote:
Orginally posted by naudurivsm
Quote:
Orginally posted by Big B
my children were both born outside India,,,but I feel they fulfill all the other conditions that you define...I would still call them Indians...many are born in a land but display little respect to it and its values and heritage....whilst the contrary may be true as well....possible?
No, technically your childres are only PIO's ( Person of Indian Origins),
However you can still induce the "Indian values" in them and raise them in a way they adopt all Indian values not just your name.
honestly it all depends on a "good" parentism"
I know there are here people in your situation and have suceeded in making their kids follow all Indian culture,tradition and values.
Try doing the follwing;
> Making a trip back to India at least once every two years,keeping
them in touch with your /our Homeland and the culture over there.
> Sharing with them the culture and values
> Also make them speak at least the "Mother toungue fluently" including
writing. - if required put them in tutions etc.
> visitng religious places ( temples ) regulasrly and also conducting the
pujas at home as well, specially for all ocasssions etc.
> If they are girls then you can make them learn cultural dances etc.
So it is all about, how we follow the "Indian Values" ourselves and how we preach them to "Other Non-Indians or Not True indians" This is what I exactly meant in my earlierr post.
Try doing the follwing;
> Making a trip back to India at least once every two years,keeping
them in touch with your /our Homeland and the culture over there. -
I know of many who are dragged unwillingly by their parents back to India - what is important is not the frequency of the visits but that they look forward to going back and being with family and experiencing the different things that India has to offer during their stay....and not turning up their noses at what they see when they get there.
> Sharing with them the culture and values
That ought to happen irrespective. That ought to be happening in any home.
> Also make them speak at least the "Mother toungue fluently" including
writing. - if required put them in tutions etc.
Again - no force to be applied - no forced tuition - they should learn it naturally in their growing years by hearing their parents speaking it as effortlessly as any other language and they will pick it up naturally too - this way it is a natural process of absorbtion - rather than ramming it down their throat.
> visitng religious places ( temples ) regulasrly and also conducting the
pujas at home as well, specially for all ocasssions etc.
Formal religious pratice and rituals has no correlation with being good or spiritual. I abhor rituals as I see them as being done by a majority more for show than with any heart felt devotion. If I need to communicate with my creator, I do NOT need any middleman. I can have a conversation with him/her whilst walking down the street, whilst bathing, before I go to sleep. So why the fixation on formal ceremony. I believe in teaching my children to respect their parents, grandparents, elders, freinds and fellow humans and then to respect God. There is no compulsion here agin to visit a Church or a temple or a osque at a detremined frequency. Faith is internal and private - most ceremonies and rituals are public performances of devotion.
> If they are girls then you can make them learn cultural dances etc.
Again if they show a natural liking towards it. Sure the kids must be exposed to Indian musaic and dance like they should be expposed to oethrs types of arts too. They shoudl be encouraged to take up and pursue and perfect whatever they enjoy. If not - with force nothing lasting will be achieved. On the contrary - they might get turned off everything that we may have tried to introduce them to.
Hope you can appreciate my point of view. It is different from yours. I am not saying that yours is wrong. If it works for you and your kids - go for it. It is not my game plan though.
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Big B
